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| Height Standard; Opinions | |
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| Topic Started: Aug 28 2008, 11:21 AM (269 Views) | |
| Post #1 Aug 28 2008, 11:21 AM | Katie Rogers |
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In everyone's opinion is a dog that is slightly under the height standard still okay to register as a Russell Terrier? I speaking of dogs that are between 9-10" tall. What is everyone's opinion on this matter? My goal is to breed straight legged correctly conformed dog that are between 9-11" as that is my personal preference in size with 10" being my ideal. I know that this differs from what many of you breed and I'm wanting to know what people think of registering these slightly under height dogs with UKC or AKC. Thank you everyone. PS- Wasn't sure exactly where to post this question so feel free to move it is you guys think it's more appropriate elsewhere 
Edited by Katie Rogers, Aug 28 2008, 11:35 AM.
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| Post #2 Aug 28 2008, 12:42 PM | Rolling Hill |
I would breed from a dog a half inch over or under the standard if the dog had plenty to offer my breeding program. In general, I think most people measure their dogs on the short side and most dogs that are advertised as 9 inches are actually more like 9.5 to 10. It all depends on how alert or relaxed the dog is when you make the measurements. Also, with some ungroomed rough coats, you might get an extra 1/2-1 inch just in hair! 
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| Post #3 Aug 28 2008, 08:50 PM | Ruscal |
 Katie, I like the small ones too, but in my opinion...if you limit yourself to only breeding really short and only keep really short you may create dwarfism...can't think of the medical term for it, my mind has gone blank...  need more coffee...I think tall and short both have a place in the breed. But that is my opinion only and you are free to do your thing, "Katie Style"...  Goodluck with whatever you decide...   xo |
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| Post #4 Aug 29 2008, 02:35 AM | Liz Mc |
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Would I use a dog or bitch that was slightly over 12 inches? In a New York minute I would as long as that terrier is superior in structure and movement. Would I use a terrier that is slightly under 10 inches? Definitely I would use one just under 10 inches but it would have to be really superior in every way. Katie, I prefer my terriers to be between 11 and 12 inches rather than at the bottom end of the height standard. It is so difficult to breed a well anguled, long necked, good moving very small terrier. And while I am a bit of a "head and bone" person I want the structure and breed type above all. I do not breed for height as long as the height is within the breed standard, but I do not want a group of tiny terriers. I want a terrier that can hold his own in the ground working live quarry and in the show ring as well as in my bed and on my sofa. That doesn't mean I want a group of too tall ones either. |
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| Post #5 Aug 29 2008, 02:02 PM | Katie Rogers |
I am concerned about producing dwarfed dogs. Which is a big reason why I am looking for a slightly taller dog to use on some of my smaller girls in hopes of adding some height without just adding leg. I want my dogs very proportional. I am hoping to keep the extremely beautiful heads that I have in my smaller dogs but add some height so as not to have to worry about producing dwarfism and the health concerns that come along with that. I guess only time will tell if I will be able to accomplish my goals. I'm sure going to have fun trying though!! |
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| Post #6 Aug 29 2008, 02:14 PM | Katie Rogers |
I agree about measuring short. I am going through and remeasuring some of my dogs and finding that when I really make them stand up and pick their heads up rather than sniffing something on the ground. They are a little taller than I had first thought. I wonder if people that say their dogs are 8 inches really realize how VERY short that is. I have one female that I bought as a potential breeder who has just never grown and she really is right at 9 inches. She is TINY. Surprisingly straight legged though as I have found the shorter the dog gets the more chance for crooked legs. I still have not decided if I will breed her as her parent's are not as short as she is and I don't know if that small size is something she is going to pass on or not. I love my little dogs but I am a bit concerned about the potential health risks to continually breeding smaller and smaller and so I am going to try to stay right around the 10 inch mark. |
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| Post #7 Sep 1 2008, 09:32 AM | Cumbreck |
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What you have to remember is it is very easy in this breed to go up in height & have good proportions, to go down in height & keep good proportions takes somewhat more skill on the breeders part. I have seen too many tall dogs over the years & i fear this breed will lose the smaller dogs due to show ring trends for a bigger dog. I really wish judges would measure the breed and not give top honours to the taller dog, a one smaller than 10" would probably not be shown anyway because you do notice the difference when they are stood beside a dog who is taller but i do see over 12" ones shown a lot. I prefer smaller for working so tend to breed and keep a smaller dog than what maybe some total show kennels only do, i just sold a really nice male i bred because he went over 12" & he is bred from a 10" & a 9", he has fired right back to taller dogs. I have repeated the mating because i loved everything else about him except the height, if i get something smaller from a repeat mating i'd rather work from the smaller dog than the taller one, if i get all taller again then i will end that path & go another direction. I do know how small 8" is!LOL i have 2 here at the moment that are that height & not dwarfs and wouldn't part with them even if you offered me a million bucks, they are worth more than their weight in gold to me personally. I'd say if you dip in and out of the height ranges to keep the proportions correct you should do just fine, its hard work though, & theres not many breeders willing to breed from dogs under 10" so you may find some breeders will look down their nose at you, just remember to keep bitches that have a nice broad pelvis if they are a bit on the smaller side & breed them to narrow shouldered males, that way you shouldn't get any whelping trouble when breeding to a taller 11-12" dog, an 11-12" male & stocky or very strongly built is somewhat more risky for smaller bitches that are less than 10" or even ones that are 10" but very lithe (slim) because they tend to breed quite large framed pups. The norm size for our newborn pups is 110g max. Edited by Cumbreck, Sep 1 2008, 09:36 AM.
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| Post #8 Sep 2 2008, 01:38 PM | Katie Rogers |
| Thank you to everyone who has responded to my question. It's very interesting to get different people's point of view. |
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| Post #9 Sep 6 2008, 06:57 PM | Rascalee |
If you are getting good structure I would keep them small. I would not breed a large dog and large bitch with lagre dogs in the history.  I agree with Ange in make sure you keep those child bearing hips on your girls. Thanks Tara |
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| Post #10 Oct 29 2008, 02:44 PM | Kim Taylor |
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What I find about certain clubs not allowing jacks to be registered and used in breeding programs if they are under "10" tall is that sooner then later what is going to happen to these jacks used in the show ring is their offsprings will become to tall. I can understand if the show ring standard is "10" to "12" inches in height but to say one cannot register a jack under "10" to me is not right and later on it will come back to get you. A lot of you said if the jack in question was under height or over you would still in fact use the jack. So how would one get that jack in question registered, lie about its height to get it in? For example I have a beautiful bitch that I held back from one of my litters and she is over height by I would say an inch to tall. But everything about her I love and yes their is some height on one of the parents side but the other parent throws very short when using him to another shorty as in "8" tall, so in fact you can still keep the right height, neck etc by breeding her to a shorter male with shorter lines in him. (possible) But I myself think taking the chance on breeding her to a shorty male to see what they would produce would be something I would in fact like to do but because of her height she cannot be registered so it seems. Kim |
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