Allied Medics for Newville?

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Allied Medics for Newville?
Topic Started: Oct 19 2009, 09:58 AM (419 Views)
cjdaley	Oct 19 2009, 09:58 AM Post #1
Unteroffizier Posts: 63 Group: Members Member #620 Joined: April 3, 2009	Wondering how many Allied Medics will be at Newville this November? Kevin Dawson (Tiny) will be setting up his battalion aid station again and I'm attempting to get a roll call of all allied medical personell attending the event (enlisted, officers, stretcher bearers and the like). My hope is to have enough people to have 2 squads of medics/stretcher bearers for the weekend. Anyway, if you're coming and want to avoid cleaning a gun on Sunday night, please chime in and help us out. Thanks.
	Christopher J. Daley tailor@cjdaley.com www.cjdaley.com “What we have of blood and treasure are yours, In the presence of the illustrious dead, we pledge our hearts and our honor in carrying the war to a successful conclusion, Lafayette, we are here!” -Colonel C. E. Stanton; July 1917


NCDOUGHBOYMEDIC	Oct 21 2009, 06:44 PM Post #2
Private Posts: 8 Group: Members Member #299 Joined: March 14, 2007	I'll be there, look forward to working with you all. I have stretcher to use if we need it. Josh Blake



cjdaley	Oct 22 2009, 07:50 AM Post #3
Unteroffizier Posts: 63 Group: Members Member #620 Joined: April 3, 2009	NCDOUGHBOYMEDIC Oct 21 2009, 06:44 PM I'll be there, look forward to working with you all. I have stretcher to use if we need it. Josh Blake Thanks Josh. Vince said you'd be there. I know Brian Merrick will help out when he's not blowing stuff up. Brian and I each have a stretcher so we can at least stack the stretchers, but it would be nice to ge at least 6 privates to work with Kevin Dawson as the officer. We don't all have to be AEF, so if some Aussies, French, Russians and/or Brits want to help out, please chime in.
	Christopher J. Daley tailor@cjdaley.com www.cjdaley.com “What we have of blood and treasure are yours, In the presence of the illustrious dead, we pledge our hearts and our honor in carrying the war to a successful conclusion, Lafayette, we are here!” -Colonel C. E. Stanton; July 1917


BuglerJay	Oct 22 2009, 03:23 PM Post #4
Sergeant Posts: 114 Group: Members Member #227 Joined: October 24, 2006	Do you need an extra stretcher? I have one that I can bring for the stack. I've also got a large box - marked: MED & SURG CHEST - - MED DEPT USA with a Caduceus and MED DEPT on one end and a Red Cross type cross on the other. It measures 25"L x 15 1/2" W x 12" T. There is a partition inside making two sections, one 10" wide and the other 14". Some dimwit painted it black sometime a while back, but signs of the original OD green paint show through in a couple of places. Same or other dimwit drilled a couple of small holes in the top on one end - easily repaired. I'll have it at Newville as well and if someone is interested enough - may be willing to let go of it. Photos on request. Cheers!



cjdaley	Oct 22 2009, 04:03 PM Post #5
Unteroffizier Posts: 63 Group: Members Member #620 Joined: April 3, 2009	BuglerJay Oct 22 2009, 03:23 PM Do you need an extra stretcher? I have one that I can bring for the stack. I've also got a large box - marked: MED & SURG CHEST - - MED DEPT USA with a Caduceus and MED DEPT on one end and a Red Cross type cross on the other. It measures 25"L x 15 1/2" W x 12" T. There is a partition inside making two sections, one 10" wide and the other 14". Some dimwit painted it black sometime a while back, but signs of the original OD green paint show through in a couple of places. Same or other dimwit drilled a couple of small holes in the top on one end - easily repaired. I'll have it at Newville as well and if someone is interested enough - may be willing to let go of it. Photos on request. Cheers! I think we're cool with stretchers, honestly carrying someone on a stretcher is a really dangerous idea and I'm only going to do it under these conditions: 1) I have 4 able bodied guys fit enough to carry someone for 2-3 hundred yards. 2) I have a 'victim' willing to do it and not too worried if we drop him from the stretcher onto the shale from several feet up. 3) I have a 'victim' who's less manly than most reenactors. Don't take offense, we can all afford to lose a few pounds, but if you are a 'more manly' reenactor you may get a chest, head or arm wound....if you're less manly, you'll get a leg wound. I don't mean to judge people, but when it comes to preserving my back and shoulders (and my stretcher) I hope you understand. 4) I have a long stretch of road to carry the litter on. The trenches are too narrow to get the stretchers down and we can't turn corners with the stretchers so we'll have to use the roads. My hope is that this adds to the scenario and not detract from it using the roads. I'd rather see a bunch of strechers heading through no mans land than a bunch of zombie soldiers coming back from a trench raid.
	Christopher J. Daley tailor@cjdaley.com www.cjdaley.com “What we have of blood and treasure are yours, In the presence of the illustrious dead, we pledge our hearts and our honor in carrying the war to a successful conclusion, Lafayette, we are here!” -Colonel C. E. Stanton; July 1917


jk816	Oct 23 2009, 02:51 PM Post #6
Offizierstellvertreter Posts: 483 Group: Members Member #32 Joined: July 24, 2005	cjdaley Oct 22 2009, 04:03 PM BuglerJay Oct 22 2009, 03:23 PM Do you need an extra stretcher? I have one that I can bring for the stack. I've also got a large box - marked: MED & SURG CHEST - - MED DEPT USA with a Caduceus and MED DEPT on one end and a Red Cross type cross on the other. It measures 25"L x 15 1/2" W x 12" T. There is a partition inside making two sections, one 10" wide and the other 14". Some dimwit painted it black sometime a while back, but signs of the original OD green paint show through in a couple of places. Same or other dimwit drilled a couple of small holes in the top on one end - easily repaired. I'll have it at Newville as well and if someone is interested enough - may be willing to let go of it. Photos on request. Cheers! I think we're cool with stretchers, honestly carrying someone on a stretcher is a really dangerous idea and I'm only going to do it under these conditions: 1) I have 4 able bodied guys fit enough to carry someone for 2-3 hundred yards. 2) I have a 'victim' willing to do it and not too worried if we drop him from the stretcher onto the shale from several feet up. 3) I have a 'victim' who's less manly than most reenactors. Don't take offense, we can all afford to lose a few pounds, but if you are a 'more manly' reenactor you may get a chest, head or arm wound....if you're less manly, you'll get a leg wound. I don't mean to judge people, but when it comes to preserving my back and shoulders (and my stretcher) I hope you understand. 4) I have a long stretch of road to carry the litter on. The trenches are too narrow to get the stretchers down and we can't turn corners with the stretchers so we'll have to use the roads. My hope is that this adds to the scenario and not detract from it using the roads. I'd rather see a bunch of strechers heading through no mans land than a bunch of zombie soldiers coming back from a trench raid. Chris, Mike Williamson of the 109th is coming as well. He's bringing kit for both medic or rifleman, and will do whatever is the greatest need. He normally does medic though. Haven't heard about Jason Hall yet. Two other possibles are Marv Chadab and Tony Sattilaro of the 29th ID; they've done medic in the past as well (Marv's a real doc, actually). Never had any BEF or French guys as medics (just customers!), but it is only a matter of time there. Jim



SirJames	Oct 30 2009, 10:28 AM Post #7
Vize-Feldwebel Posts: 173 Group: Members Member #79 Joined: November 1, 2005	It is looking like one, possibly two Guardsmen will be turning out as Stretcher Bearers. I will be sure to send them your way to add a few Tommies to the mix. Jim
	Grenadier Guards 2nd Battalion, Number Two Company Guards Division


jk816	Oct 30 2009, 09:27 PM Post #8
Offizierstellvertreter Posts: 483 Group: Members Member #32 Joined: July 24, 2005	SirJames Oct 30 2009, 10:28 AM It is looking like one, possibly two Guardsmen will be turning out as Stretcher Bearers. I will be sure to send them your way to add a few Tommies to the mix. Jim Jim, Thanks, it is good to see the Allied medical impressions really coming into their own as a functioning detachment; it certainly adds depth to the event. Be nice if the CP side could make similar strides. Jim Kidd



cjdaley	Nov 1 2009, 01:01 PM Post #9
Unteroffizier Posts: 63 Group: Members Member #620 Joined: April 3, 2009	Jim, That's great news. My hope is to use all allied medics/docs/stretcher bearers as a 'battalion' effort instead of a AEF, BEF, Russian or other nationality effort. ALL: Take a look at this amazing essay on the logistics of trench evacuation. I think if we employed a fraction of this into our event this weekend we'll all learn alot. http://www.vlib.us/medical/ramc/ramc.htm I think the simple act of having a medic/stretcher bearer afix a 'diagnosis tag' to the wounded soldier it'll be a form of a chit system and will allow people to cycle back into the trenches a good pace.
	Christopher J. Daley tailor@cjdaley.com www.cjdaley.com “What we have of blood and treasure are yours, In the presence of the illustrious dead, we pledge our hearts and our honor in carrying the war to a successful conclusion, Lafayette, we are here!” -Colonel C. E. Stanton; July 1917


sanitaeter	Nov 2 2009, 10:05 AM Post #10
Vize-Feldwebel Posts: 161 Group: Members Member #100 Joined: December 2, 2005	as one of the few Central powers medical people, I am envious of the numbers you have in the medical role. If it wasn't for the fact that you are all aggressors against our small and defendless nation of peaceloving people, I would love to be with you. Peter



cjdaley	Nov 2 2009, 10:46 AM Post #11
Unteroffizier Posts: 63 Group: Members Member #620 Joined: April 3, 2009	sanitaeter Nov 2 2009, 10:05 AM as one of the few Central powers medical people, I am envious of the numbers you have in the medical role. If it wasn't for the fact that you are all aggressors against our small and defendless nation of peaceloving people, I would love to be with you. Peter Peter, We'll work out something this weekend together. Maybe we'll help evac someone in no man's land together or something. Talk to you more on Friday!
	Christopher J. Daley tailor@cjdaley.com www.cjdaley.com “What we have of blood and treasure are yours, In the presence of the illustrious dead, we pledge our hearts and our honor in carrying the war to a successful conclusion, Lafayette, we are here!” -Colonel C. E. Stanton; July 1917


jk816	Nov 2 2009, 02:15 PM Post #12
Offizierstellvertreter Posts: 483 Group: Members Member #32 Joined: July 24, 2005	sanitaeter Nov 2 2009, 10:05 AM as one of the few Central powers medical people, I am envious of the numbers you have in the medical role. If it wasn't for the fact that you are all aggressors against our small and defendless nation of peaceloving people, I would love to be with you. Peter Peter, It can and should happen on the CP side too. Two years ago there was no such effort on the Allied side, just a few isolated medics. Then Kevin Dawson volunteered to get an aid station setup and the medics had a place to work from. Then the Allies implemented the wound chit/ recycling system, which uses the medics and aid station in recycling in combat; which gave the medical folks a real function in action, not just a neat impression. They are as necessary as riflemen or Machinegunners, and ties in another area of depth in the event. Now units look to be part of medical scenarios and wounded call for medics who actually come. And now the role (note not just an impression but a role), has attracted guys like Chris who wish to evolve it further. It will only get better form there. So the CP side can have it there too, but need to have the CP side want it and use it. So far the CP side has not implemented the wound/ recycling program (note it is a GWA program not just Allied, but the CP side had asked to phase it in slowly there). The CP leadership has reported that units are slow, reluctant or unwilling to embrace it, and progress in implementation is slow. Until that happens and the CP side , like the Allies, gets in the habit of going to the rear when hit, or looking for aidmen when hit, etc, the medical part of the CP side will just be an impression and not a role. So the CP rank and file should take up on the Allies lead and tell their leaders they want the wound recycling system, ask where their aid staiton is when they are hit, get their buddies to do so as well and give your leadership the message that you want this aspect on your side too. You guys can do anything the Allies can and better, right? Its up to you guys to make it happen; I know the CP rep would appreciate a groundswell of support in this. Jim Kidd



jk816	Nov 2 2009, 02:35 PM Post #13
Offizierstellvertreter Posts: 483 Group: Members Member #32 Joined: July 24, 2005	cjdaley Nov 1 2009, 01:01 PM Jim, That's great news. My hope is to use all allied medics/docs/stretcher bearers as a 'battalion' effort instead of a AEF, BEF, Russian or other nationality effort. ALL: Take a look at this amazing essay on the logistics of trench evacuation. I think if we employed a fraction of this into our event this weekend we'll all learn alot. http://www.vlib.us/medical/ramc/ramc.htm I think the simple act of having a medic/stretcher bearer afix a 'diagnosis tag' to the wounded soldier it'll be a form of a chit system and will allow people to cycle back into the trenches a good pace. Chris, Here are the simplified wound system rules in place at this time; use these as your starting point in field triage, and see where you think we can take it from there. 1. All “wounds” require medical intervention prior to recycling. 2. Each soldier will draw a wound marker prior to entering the lines. It will indicate the severity of a wound when a participant does take his next hit. Yellow denotes a minor wound, red a severe wound and black a mortal wound. In the case where a participant fails to draw a chit before entering the line, the default is Mortal (black) wound. 3. A minor (yellow) wound allows the participant to be ambulatory and must go to the Aid Station (rear or recycle point where chit collections are stationed). No additional wait time is required; the participant should draw a new fate marker and return to the line. A bandage, if available, may be tied around the arm to indicate a minor wound, and may be placed there by the injured, friends or medics 4. A severe (red) wound requires assistance to go to the Aid station; however if unassisted after 10 minutes, you may crawl to the rear; a wait time of 5 minutes at the Aid Station is required. A bandage, if available, may be tied around the leg to denote a severe wound. 5. A mortal (black) wound requires assistance to go to the rear, however if unassisted after waiting 15 minutes, you may exit the battlefield at the nearest point (going around the tactical area), go to the nearest aid station, wait 10 minutes before returning to the line. A bandage, if available, may be placed around the head or chest to denote a mortal wound. In your time while being “dead” you should remain motionless and silent. 6. Being treated by a medic, first aid man or other forward medical type will reduce the severity of the wound by one category (i.e.: from red to yellow, or black to red). Those with minor (yellow) wounds may return to action immediately after being treated by a medic. Medics may treat wounded of either side. Belligerents should avoid targeting of medical personnel. 7. Wounded (other than mortal) within areas in possession & presence of their enemy are captured; however the capturing force may be required to transport the wounded to their side to retain the captive. Dispatching of wounded prisoners is discouraged, but permitted. Everyone should note it does not tell you when to take a hit; it merely tells you what to do when you are hit. It also addresses another problem we have, knowing who in a trench full of bodies is still in play or not. Anyone not wearing a bandage is still in play. The Allied aid station can provide a reusable bandage to men who don't have one. Jim Kidd



BuglerJay	Nov 2 2009, 03:53 PM Post #14
Sergeant Posts: 114 Group: Members Member #227 Joined: October 24, 2006	Visited that website, Chris. Fascinating. I was a bit taken aback by the photo of an ambulance "heated by its exhaust." Weren't the Germans using something like that for a different purpose in WWII? Seriously - great info on that site. See you this weekend! I'm already packing.



1st Engineers	Nov 4 2009, 08:32 AM Post #15
Sergeant Major Posts: 144 Group: Members Member #135 Joined: March 17, 2006	Dear all: The AEF found out fairly fast that exhaust gas heaters were a bad idea.... a GHQ AEF GO N0 2 January 3 , 1918 directied that all exhaust gas heaters be inspected and further directed addition of 1 inch holes be bored in ambulance bodies to improve ventilation. Holes were to be bored in both tailboard and the bulkhead between patient compartment and cab. Ambulance drivers were directed to check on patients in transport at 5 minute intervals. From the description in the GO it is clear they were referring to Model T Ford "Light Ambulances". Streve McG



cjdaley	Nov 4 2009, 10:28 AM Post #16
Unteroffizier Posts: 63 Group: Members Member #620 Joined: April 3, 2009	I just read a memoir from an ambulance driver and he talked about the lessons they learned on the battlefield and how drill learned in Pennsylvania was useless. The biggest lesson learned in combat: "Don't put the 'bleeders' on the top stretcher above a 'non-bleeder'"
	Christopher J. Daley tailor@cjdaley.com www.cjdaley.com “What we have of blood and treasure are yours, In the presence of the illustrious dead, we pledge our hearts and our honor in carrying the war to a successful conclusion, Lafayette, we are here!” -Colonel C. E. Stanton; July 1917


Bill	Nov 4 2009, 11:23 AM Post #17
Lance Corporal Posts: 31 Group: Members Member #503 Joined: July 13, 2008	My Great Grandfather was a litter bearer. The one thing he told my dad was that the litter bearers were ordered to pick up anyone who was alive, German or American, this during the Muese Argonne. PFC. Fean also said to my dad that the bodies would fall apart as they picked them up. Alfred Fean was only 20 years old. I posted in the veterans and ancestors folder his experiences from the journey over to the Muese Argonne offensive. Bill Fean


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