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Questions; Specific Book Questions
Topic Started: Mar 28 2006, 05:50 PM (4,190 Views)
TomRK1089
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Magnum PI
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Oh, I agree, but in the actual writing process I've gotten no submissions, edits, or revisions from other members, so I don't see how you all can complain that it's somewhat shoddy.

On that note, I'm going to allow that specific topic to be edited by all regged members -- then there'll be no complaints. :D
Think twice before you speak, and then you may be able to say something more insulting than if you spoke right out at once.
Evan Esar, Esar's Comic Dictionary
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Balthier
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Please dont take my post as a complaint, hence, why it was originally a question. And if you ever have something with the book you feel you want to discuss with like, the board or someone specific then why dont ya?! This is what this boards for, right? As for submissions, well, thats why I made the luxury items thread! :)
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Assassin
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The lefty guy
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TomRK1089
Nov 30 2006, 06:37 PM
Currently it's (the Book) just Tom's opinion because no one's bloody well offered to help write the damn thing. If you can't be bothered, don't complain.

Either Ive missed something, or your misunderstanding me. I was referring to your idea of having a reward system based on completion of set tasks. I thought the reward system weve put down in the book was the one we discussed, based on the effort you put in to help support society.

0.o?

EDIT: After re-reading the economic chapters of the book, Ive noticed that theres no mention of the incentive/reward system at all :blink:
"Shoot, coward, you will only kill a man." - Che Guevera

"Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate, but that we are powerful beyond measure." - Nelson Mandela

Project Legacy - Building the Future

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TomRK1089
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Stick it in y'self, then; that's why you're allowed to EDIT stuff, Alan.
Think twice before you speak, and then you may be able to say something more insulting than if you spoke right out at once.
Evan Esar, Esar's Comic Dictionary
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Assassin
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The lefty guy
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...right.

EDIT: *has edited the book to read "Production Manager" instead of "Distribution Manager" and "PM" instead of "DM", which makes sense cos its the production of resources not the distribution that they oversee.*

*will put a bit about the incentive system in later*

Also, it seems the incentive systems being debated again now so Ill leave editing that in until were agreed again one way or the other on what it will consist of.
"Shoot, coward, you will only kill a man." - Che Guevera

"Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate, but that we are powerful beyond measure." - Nelson Mandela

Project Legacy - Building the Future

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Balthier
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I have a question concerning the actual concept of Project Legacy. What has finally come to my attention is that project legacy is mainly about reformatting the state to represent a productive, fair, and democratic structure. But the state is only created when there are irreconceivabilitys between classes where one class initiates a repressive force over the other. In this case, i'm seeing the RM's and DM's as the exploiters (Because there are still capitalist tendencies, primarily in the luxury items) while the LE's still represent the state. So the question i'm asking is, how many of you truely consider remodeling the state as considerable? I'm not attempting to take over this board with my Marxist ways or anything, but in all honesty, has history not proven what the state amounts too? Though i'm all for the dictatorship of the proletariat, that is much different then what Project Legacy is doing because the DotP is withering away, while project Legacy is formatting a solid basis for the state. What are your thoughts on this? Should we truely work on a neutral state structure which may truely not be possible (Yes, think of neutrality. It would mean beneficial to the exploited while the exploiters remain at top. This is not that simple to format)? Let me know your thoughts on this.
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Assassin
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Balthier
Dec 6 2006, 03:38 PM
I have a question concerning the actual concept of Project Legacy. What has finally come to my attention is that project legacy is mainly about reformatting the state to represent a productive, fair, and democratic structure. But the state is only created when there are irreconceivabilitys between classes where one class initiates a repressive force over the other.

Not necessarily so. I find anarchy to be an admirable goal, but unworkable unless done only with select people chosen for their selflessness - in a large-scale society, there will always be some form of power, because if you DID abolish the the state completely and not replace it with anything, what you would be left with is warlord conflicts between a number of mini totalitarian states based on the coercion of the weak by the strong smart and ruthless, which is more than likely how the first grossly uncivilised "civilisations" (such as the Pharohs Egypt, or the Chinese & Roman Empires) came to pass. This is demonstrated by the fact that the majority of people who claim (note keyword: claim. this is not a slight against genuine anarchists) to be anarchists only support the idea of anarchy because they think it represents a free-for-all (in the words of Thomas Hobbes, "war of all against all"), which unfortunately is a self-fulfilling prophecy - because there are so many people like this, their view becomes not too far from the truth.

Therefore, since the aim of Project Legacy is to make the world a better place, some laws and some form of executive power is required to prevent a more restrictive, totalitarian and vertically-structured state from destroying and rising from the ashes of what may have been, for a few weeks or a few months, utopian anarchy.

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In this case, i'm seeing the RM's and DM's as the exploiters

Not really, because there chosen directly by the people at a very local level, so each and every individual person has a large say in the future of an RM or DM they believe is abusing his/her power. If there was exploitation going on, it would be stamped out pretty quickly.

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Should we truely work on a neutral state structure which may truely not be possible (Yes, think of neutrality. It would mean beneficial to the exploited while the exploiters remain at top. This is not that simple to format)?

Your description bothers me - the idea in Project Legacy is that there isnt anyone "on top".
"Shoot, coward, you will only kill a man." - Che Guevera

"Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate, but that we are powerful beyond measure." - Nelson Mandela

Project Legacy - Building the Future

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TomRK1089
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Well, I disagree that this will create new classes per se. But again, the goal isn't to do away with all government institutions -- simply to preserve what works, and do away with that that doesn't.
Think twice before you speak, and then you may be able to say something more insulting than if you spoke right out at once.
Evan Esar, Esar's Comic Dictionary
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ProjectMember
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Mar 28 2006, 05:50 PM
EINSTEINEDIT: Here is where you ask specific questions about things mentioned in the book, rather than in the Project Topics subforum.

The Book
 
Authority Positions are chosen after candidates have been thoroughly vetted and qualified by an approved group of doctors and psychiatrists.

Who exactly chooses the members of this group?

Are you not educated enough to figure this out by yourself?
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Assassin
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I can only think of 2 answers off the top of my head - A) the final Project Legacy team which releases the Project to the public, or B ) the contemporary scientific establishment. I dunno about anyone else, but neither option seems particularly desirable to me...

Also, may I suggest someone with administrative forum access edits this dudes name so that it doesnt seem like hes speaking for the Project? <_<
"Shoot, coward, you will only kill a man." - Che Guevera

"Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate, but that we are powerful beyond measure." - Nelson Mandela

Project Legacy - Building the Future

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Muad'Dib
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Alright alright, this may be a super huge Necropost, but I decided to get off my ass and read some off the things this site is for, mainly because I've not had much to do lately, and I think I'll actually try to contribute.

RM and DM, higher ups so to speak, right? You say though that they are paid no less, right? This isn't just me I'm thinking of, I think a large portion of the world is selfish, including me a lot of the time. But, I was thinking, what incentive do these RM and DMs have for running for the position if it doesn't have any advantages. Really I guess it gives you control over more, but, having that power can also be stress inducing, with that weight on your shoulders, no matter how well the doctors who check them out say they are. But them again, I'm thinking about what the book said, you said "selfless" people, so it is going to be harder to find candidates for those positions without any kind of benefit. Who knows, maybe I've just never met someone truly selfless to know what I'm talking about.

As for paying, for different jobs, all I can really think of is to divide jobs into categories and have the categories determine payment and benefits. Say, the harder the work, the better the pay, and less benefits on the side. Wait, I'm not going to edit that, I did realize though, that's stupid, what I said just now, because if you're working the harder work, you're bound to have medical problems at some point, so then you would need health benefits. Damn it, perhaps I should reread the book saying anything else and risking sounding like an ignorant jackass.
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Zephir
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I've actually been thinking about something like that. Not so much changing base pay but paying more for more motivated or generally better workers. You can get into a job of course, but if you do the bare minimum to get it done, you get the bare minimum.
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Muad'Dib
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But when you say you're paying the more motivated and harder workers more, do you mean with luxury points (can't recall what you called them in the book.)?

Also, elaborating more on the category idea. I was thinking keeping it simple would be good. But it's rather hard to throw a world of diverse jobs into three or four categories. Like, the first thing that came to my head was three or four, like, people who work indoors, or hard laborers. You throw them into category based on conditions, and base the pay on their those condition's merits and of course, who ever decides too put forth more effort than required will make a few extra shillings so to speak.

Who knows, maybe I'm taking it in the wrong direction. This is my first real attempt to add to this place, so maybe I should read around a bit and see more about what you, the leaders of this place's ideals are like.

I was kind of distracted when I went through the Book, but I got most of it. It sounds like you want to build a society that survives on what is absolutely necessity and not focus on all materialistic things. Please do correct me if I'm wrong.

I mean I'm honestly pretty materialistic, but I still think that people only need a basic set of things to survive and be happy. And it sounds like that luxury point system is a good way to balance overly materialistic people, reward the people who deserve actually do deserve the things that are widely available to us, and encourage people to work better and in long hopefully be happier. At least this is what I'm getting from that aspect of the Legacy. Like I said, correct me if I'm wrong.
Thats what she said...
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Assassin
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Muad'Dib
May 15 2008, 10:36 PM
But, I was thinking, what incentive do these RM and DMs have for running for the position if it doesn't have any advantages.

People who would look on a higher rate of pay as a major factor in their decision to take a post of authority are more likely to be vulnerable to corruption, and therefore should be kept out of those positions anyway. So apart from the inherent moral imperative of an equal rate of pay, it also serves the double purpose of keeping the majority of people likely to abuse their position out of RM and DM offices by their own choice.

Ill reply to the rest later.
"Shoot, coward, you will only kill a man." - Che Guevera

"Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate, but that we are powerful beyond measure." - Nelson Mandela

Project Legacy - Building the Future

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Zephir
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There is no such thing as a good tax.
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I'd reply to this, but since I'm lazy and my memory's slightly foggy on the method we actually agreed on, I'll let Assassin reply for me. :P
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"You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life."
Winston Churchill
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